The Church holds that the communion
bread and wine do not change properties (i.e. appearance, density, etc.), but they do change essence (i.e. what they are).
Not exact matches
For if a man or a woman's body — or his or her status as a married person, or his capacity to be a father or hers to be a mother — doesn't matter for his or her sex life, why, then, should anyone imagine that the body of the Son of God matters, whether it is in a manger, on a cross, risen, or fully
and really present under the signs of
bread and wine?
(a) there are obvious visible changes in the condiments after the Catholic priest
does his hocus pocus; (b) tests have confirmed a divine presence in the
bread and wine; (c) now
and then their god shows up
and confirms this story; or (d) their religious convictions tell them to blindly accept this completely fvcking absurd nonsense.
He also suggests that the eschatological prospect entertained by Jesus is a later addition,
and notes that it has nothing to
do with the gift of
bread and wine.
We
do well to gather our memories around things we can touch, especially baptismal water
and the
bread and wine of the Easter meal.
A little unleavened
bread and a cup of
wine will
do in most cases, because what truly brings us together is the word.
In the final frame the menorah becomes a smoldering cross,
and in a nearby cave (an empty tomb),
bread and wine are set at a table with the words «
Do this in remembrance of me.»
Yet Jesus at the last supper; when he instituted this sacrament,
did not refuse Judas the
bread and the
wine, despite the fact that he knew Judas was his betrayer.
The Scriptures, after all, speak constantly of a God who uses objects, yokes, pots,
bread,
wine and water to
do his purposes.
For what
do we long for when we read the Beatitudes, when we meditate on the words of Christ through lectio divina, when we join with Christians past
and present to pray the hours, when we climb Teresa of Avila's «Interior Castle,» when we raise our hands in worship, when we eat the
bread and drink the
wine, when we walk the labyrinths, when like David we see that the night sky declares the glory of God, when we study the Bible in Hebrew
and Greek, when we connect with a glorious line from Wendell Berry or Frederick Buechner, or Annie Dillard?
And the Lord's Supper confers grace because while one eats the bread and sips the wine — er, I mean the grape juice — one remembers what Jesus did on the cro
And the Lord's Supper confers grace because while one eats the
bread and sips the wine — er, I mean the grape juice — one remembers what Jesus did on the cro
and sips the
wine — er, I mean the grape juice — one remembers what Jesus
did on the cross.
Nearer to the heart of the matter, but not so unanswerable, is a third question:
Did Jesus himself partake of the
bread and wine?
When I talk to my good friend who is a very conservative Catholic who views taking communion as sacred
and every crumb is representative of Christ's body
and not one crumb will drop... then compare it to how we
do it at church... everyone ripping
bread from the same loaf, crumbs everywhere, kids spilling the «
wine»...
does it really matter... is one more right than the other... one upholds church law on how communion will be performed versus our laid back version.
You likely deny evolution
and global warming for no other reason than it makes you uncomfortable
and hold science to the impossibly high standard of having to explain every conceivable mystery about the natural World before you will accept it, but some moron at a pulpit
doing magic hand signals of a Sundaymorning is enough to convince you he is communicating with some sky - god
and turning grocery store
bread and wine into flesh
and blood.
You all fight for first place at a table that eats
bread and wine, but it doesn't give you carte blanche to pass judgement on others.
Of course, what
do people
do in countries that really don't have
bread and wine?
So just as baptism could be
done with a few drops of water, so also the Lord's Supper could be observed with a small bit of
bread and a few drops of
wine.
The tradition of using a tiny bit of
bread and wine (or juice) has continued to be practiced, even though it
does not even come close to what was practiced by Jesus
and His apostles on the night He was betrayed,
and reflects instead some sort of magical ceremony where some people believe that God is giving them special grace
and power through the ritual elements of
bread and wine.
nah — they believe that grocary store
bread and wine becomes the flesh
and blood of a dead Jew from 2,000 years ago because a priest
does some hocus - pocus over it in church of a Sunday morning; that a being reads my mind whenever I pray
and intervenes to change what would otherwise be the course of history in small ways to «answer my prayers»;
and that I will survive my own physical deathand live happily ever after if I follow some rules laid down by goat herders in Bronze Age Palestine.
Go, eat your
bread with enjoyment,
and drink your
wine with a merry heart; for God has already approved what you
do.
«We must say that the accidents of the
bread and the
wine, which are perceived by the senses as remaining after consecration,
do not have as their subject the substance of the
bread and the
wine, since, as has been said, that
does not continue to exist.
(a) Grocery store
bread and wine becomes the flesh
and blood of a dead Jew from 2,000 years ago because a priest
does some hocus pocus over it in church of a Sunday morning.
For me I
do believe in the Sacraments
and the role they play in Salvation - Jesus
did change
wine into this blood
and the
bread into his body during the last supper
and told believers to
do this in his memory
and he
did foreshadow what would happen on the Cross he gave up his life so we maybe could be saved, because not all who profess Christ is Lord or believe in God will be saved, there are many people who claim they can abuse, sleep around, steal, cheat
and that they'll still go to heave because 1 day they said the sinner's prayer, actions speak louder then words.
My principal problem with the flood of «how to create community» books is not that they're trying to create community, but the terminally silly means they're using to
do it — Super Bowls
and tailgate parties, nachos
and beer instead of the means God gave us: prayer
and praise,
bread and wine.
While modern science, history, geology, biology,
and physics have failed to convince you of the deep inanity of your silly faith, some priest
doing magic hand signals over grocery store
bread and wine is enough to convince you it is thereby transformed into the flesh
and blood of Jesus, because of the priest's magic powers (or «sacred powers» if you prefer the more euphemistic term).
Sitting around eating
bread and drinking
wine has it's place but like anything can become a simple case of chronic loafing if that's all you
do.
I don't know about baptism but I'd like to exchange
bread and wine for cheezits
and diet dr pepper for communion.
The reception of God's grace through baptism
does not automatically confer new life on the recipient; participation in the Lord's Supper
does not necessarily change the recipient of
bread and wine.
While modern science, history, geology, biology,
and physics have failed to convince you of the deep inanity of your silly faith, some priest
doing magic hand signals over
bread and wine is enough to convince you it is thereby transformed into the flesh
and blood of Jesus because of the priest's magic powers (or «sacred powers» to the extent you see a difference).
Furthermore, since the death
and resurrection of Jesus was central to Christian belief
and practice,
and since teaching was often
done with the help of symbols, it probably became customary as a part of nearly every meal where Christians were gathered, to remind people that the
bread they were eating represented the body of Jesus which was broken for them,
and the
wine they were drinking represented His blood.
Jesus said go
and make disciples baptising them in the name of the father
and of the son
and of The Holy Spirit, he also said on the night before he died
Do this in remembrance of me (The partaking of the
bread and wine).
31
Do not listen to Hezekiah; for thus says the king of Assyria: «Make your peace with me
and come out to me; then every one of you will eat of his own vine,
and every one of his own fig tree,
and every one of you will drink the water of his own cistern; 32 until I come
and take you away to a land like your own land, a land of grain
and wine, a land of
bread and vineyards, a land of olive trees
and honey, that you may live,
and not die.
I don't need a seat at their table — in Christ, really, there is only one table, laid out with the
bread and the
wine, there is room for me there.
How else would he have
done the «walk on water» thing
and the water to
wine thing
and the replication of the loaves of
bread and fish?
In a similar way, the Eucharist is sacramental only because the worshipper
does not rest content with the mere eating of
bread and the drinking of
wine.
In the Eucharist the worshipper
does not unite himself with Christ, but he receives the gifts of
bread and wine by which he expects inner nourishment from the sources of spiritual life upon which he depends.
offering of Christ to his heavenly Father, as we are nourished by his risen life in the receiving of
bread and wine and so «make memorial» of him
and of all that he
did and was.
Its a neo-platonic idea, they don't necessarily believe the atomic structure of the
bread and wine is actually changed, they believe its essence has changed in a spiritual sense.
Christ embraces human community fully aware of the tragic contradictions in it,
and he
does so through the symbols of
bread broken
and wine poured.
Still trying to agree on a definition of the Eucharist, theologians over a wide range of background had finally agreed in the Wittenberg Concord that «with the consecrated
bread and wine, the body
and blood of Christ are truly
and substantially present, shown forth
and received», also that the sacrament has its authentic value in the Church
and does not depend on the status of either the minister or the recipient.
Ultimately it is just
bread and wine, symbolizing Jesus
and what He
did for us, so any Christian should be welcome.
A narrative of a Lenten meditation in poetic form written from the standpoint of the apostle Thomas:
And if it were not for his love, his grace that sought me out behind locked doors, called me to touch and then believe, I would not be here at your humble table ready now with you, to break the bread and pour the wine as he did years a
And if it were not for his love, his grace that sought me out behind locked doors, called me to touch
and then believe, I would not be here at your humble table ready now with you, to break the bread and pour the wine as he did years a
and then believe, I would not be here at your humble table ready now with you, to break the
bread and pour the wine as he did years a
and pour the
wine as he
did years ago.
The only change in transubstantiation is also invisible, so the accidents of
bread and wine remain,
and so
does Jesus, until these accidents are no longer evident.
Given my belief that communion
wine can be validly consecrated into the Blood of Christ,
and communion
bread into the Body of Christ, we can now cue all the folks who will make jokes about cannibalism, etc. (just as the Romans
did about early Christians — very little anti-Christian humor is original).
And if it were not for his love, his grace that sought me out behind locked doors, called me to touch and then believe, I would not be here at your humble table ready now with you, to break the bread and pour the wine as he did years a
And if it were not for his love, his grace that sought me out behind locked doors, called me to touch
and then believe, I would not be here at your humble table ready now with you, to break the bread and pour the wine as he did years a
and then believe, I would not be here at your humble table ready now with you, to break the
bread and pour the wine as he did years a
and pour the
wine as he
did years ago.
It seemed to me as if, in all he
did that evening at the table, he too was finding meaning
and enlightenment, as if, in breaking
bread and pouring
wine, our Lord himself was being led — as we were through him — into a new
and richer comprehension, into a full
and final revelation that this, of course, was why it must be so — that only as a grain of wheat falls to the ground
and dies can it arise again
and bring forth ripe new grain to form the loaf that feeds a hungry world.
We don't eat
bread pretending it's the actual body of Christ, nor
do we drink
wine pretending it to be the actual blood of Christ; we recognize
bread as
bread,
and wine as
wine, but we know what they represent.
If you took a step back
and looked at what y» all
do in an objective way, i.e. followed some book word for word written by over 100 people over a 900 year period, gather weekly in a building
and sing songs together
and eat
bread and drink
wine as if it were anything but what it is, list goes on.
Now of course there's no real change, it's all pretend
and the stuff is still
bread and wine after he
does his magic act, but they convince themselves i has somehow changed.
I am (a) a delusional schizophrenic; (b) a naïve child, too young to know that that is silly (c) an ignorant farmer from Sudan who never had the benefit of even a fifth grade education; or (d) your average Christian Millions
and millions of Catholics believe that
bread and wine turns into the actual flesh
and blood of a dead Jew from 2,000 years ago because: (a) there are obvious visible changes in the condiments after the Catholic priest
does his hocus pocus; (b) tests have confirmed a divine presence in the
bread and wine; (c) now
and then their god shows up
and confirms this story; or (d) their religious convictions tell them to blindly accept this completely fvcking absurd nonsense.