Not exact matches
[Response: First off, he is confusing
models that include the carbon cycle with those that have been used in
hindcasts of the 20th Century and are the basis of the detection and attribution of current
climate change.
Part of the uncertainty in the attribution is of course how realistic the «noise» in the
models is — and that can be assessed by looking at
hindcasts, paleo -
climate etc..
This is of course one big reason why
climate science has focussed on this particular metric — because the
models can do a reliable and credible (validated through
hindcasting recent and paleo
climates) job at it!
Surely the
hindcast of the
models should show periods of time where the
climate signal is moving away, up and down, from the
climate and weather signal?
I don't suppose economic
models were designed to
hindcast, but, as in
climate science, a whole world view was built upon their supposed mathematical and statistical prowess.
The performance of
models using a
climate sensitivity range of from 1.0 to 5.0 is essentially equal in
hindcasting.
In the end, one need not know with a high degree of accuracy the intricacies of the
climate's variability to show an increased warming trend: 3 Furthermore, there are no
models that exist that are able to match recent observed warming without taking rising CO2 levels into account, i.e. if radiative forcings from CO2 aren't taken into account, then
models don't match
hindcasting.
4)
Climate Models Can't Even
Hindcast.
Climate model simulations confirm that an Ice Age can indeed be started in this way, while simple conceptual
models have been used to successfully «
hindcast» the onset of past glaciations based on the orbital changes.
4)
Climate models adopted by IPCC do not work; they can not forecast or hindcast climate temperature
Climate models adopted by IPCC do not work; they can not forecast or
hindcast climate temperature
climate temperature trends.
«The use of a coupled ocean — atmosphere — sea ice
model to
hindcast (i.e., historical forecast) recent
climate variability is described and illustrated for the cases of the 1976/77 and 1998/99
climate shift events in the Pacific.
Because of the «predictions» of highly flawed and dubious
climate models, most of which have a problem in making accurate
hindcasts.
More often,
models have been tested by
hindcasting — they are forced with a known change starting at a past known
climate state, and asked whether they can accurately project the output (e.g., a temperature change resulting from a change in CO2, solar forcing, etc.)?
I'm not really that familiar with the efforts that have been made to validate the
hindcast of global
climate models, BUT if they are skillful with respect to the number of degrees of freedom they use and predict, then they are skillful.
This application of the
models is made despite their inability to show multi-decadal regional and mesoscale skill in forecasting changes in
climate statistics when run in a
hindcast mode (e.g., see Pielke 2013, and also Section 13.5).
The authors» of the papers that I listed do indeed discuss skill at predicting (in
hindcast runs) the ability of multi-decadal
climate model runs to simulate the real world observed
climate.
I have presented peer reviewed papers that do, in fact, falsify the
models even with respect to their ability to predict (in
hindcast) the current
climate.
This skill must be assessed by predicting global, regional and local average
climate, and any
climate change that was observed over the last several decades (i.e. «
hindcast model predictions»).
Finally, I reiterate my request for you and Jason to present papers that document a skill of the multi-decadal (Type 4) regional
climate models to predict (in
hindcast) the observed CHANGES in
climate statistics over this time period.
As I show in my guest post, the CMIP
models not only have not shown skill at predicting (in
hindcast) regional changes in
climate statistics, but often not even the current average
climate!
Roger states that one can not consider
climate model predictions (his type 4) at the regional scale when their predictive skill in
hindcast mode is not demonstrated.
Even more importantly, unless they can actually be shown to be «plausible», it is not appropriate to present to the impacts community without the disclaimer that they have not shown skill at predicting the
climate metrics of interest when the
models are run in
hindcast.
If the
models show a lack of skill and need tuning with respect to predicting (in
hindcast) even the current
climate statistics on multi-decadal time scales (much less than CHANGES in
climate statistics), they are not ready to be used as robust projection tools for the coming decades.
Model estimates of temperatures prior to 2005 are a «
hindcast» using known past
climate influences, while temperatures projected after 2005 are a «forecast» based on a estimate of how things might change.
Most of these entailed
hindcasting, but Hansen's 1988
model projections have exhibited some skill in a forecasting mode, despite his use of inputs now known to overestimate the most likely value of
climate sensitivity.
The burden, of course, is for authors that present
hindcast multi-decadal
climate projections, to provide quantitative documentation of the ability of their
model to predict changes in the
climate metrics that are requested by the impact and policy communities.
Models fail to
hindcast past
climate on local, regional and global level: http://joannenova.com.au/2012/05/we-cant-predict-the-
climate-on-a-local-regional-or-continental-scale/
Putting that aside, has any
climate model («hypothesis») actually
hindcasted or forecasted accurately?
The final draft figure 1.4's blue envelop for the 2001 TAR's projections range is a stretch to logic since it's already + - 0,2 °C wide at the date of its publication in 2001 (instead of beeing the real temperature) meaning
climate models are not even capable of
hindcasting event most recent years.
Figure 2: Number of Katrina magnitude surge events per decade (B)
hindcast and projected changes in temperatures from
climate model BNU - ESM under for RCP4.5 (A).
In An Initial Look At The
Hindcasts Of The NCAR CCSM4 Coupled Climate Model Bob Tisdale explores hindcasts vs obse
Hindcasts Of The NCAR CCSM4 Coupled
Climate Model Bob Tisdale explores
hindcasts vs obse
hindcasts vs observations:
It documented a total of 2,418 failures of today's top - tier
climate models to accurately
hindcast a whole host of climatological phenomena.
Certainly, in Mosher's example of military planning, there are indeed cases where
hindcasting the
model would make no sense whatsoever, but we aren't talking military planning and strategy here, we are talking
climate, and we have a pretty good idea of what the
climate has been for the past 150 years, and we know that it RELATES TO how the
climate will be 150 years from now.
Obviously,
climate models whose
hindcasts differ in sign from what is observed (Zhang et al., 2007), or which indicate that human influences are indistinguishable from natural changes (Sarojini et al., 2012) possess no skill in identifying a human - induced
climate signal on observed precipitation across the U.S. and therefore should not be used to make future projections.
The
models are the weakest point of
climate science, and until they are validated this estimate of temperature rise is not possible (and using
hindcasting with tuned
models doesn't have any credibility in my book)
Unfortunately I have seen no sign that
climate modellers are refining their
models to provide accurate
hindcasts.
This late - 1970s reversal in sea ice trends was not captured by the
hindcasts of the recent CMIP5
climate models used for the latest IPCC reports, which suggests that current
climate models are still quite poor at
modelling past sea ice trends.»
This
hindcast setting roughly follows the experimental design of the Coupled
Model Intercomparison Project - 5 (CMIP5) for decadal
climate prediction (Taylor et al. 2009; Murphy et al. 2010).
This stance may be reinforced by his personal dislike of Michael Mann as well as false statements such as» [
climate]
models are barely able to
hindcast, let alone forecast».
Once they have established these ranges,
climate scientists can run the
climate models and compare their results to recent observational data (a.k.a. «
hindcasting»), and tweak the
models (within the physically allowable ranges) to match the observational data.
The
model states that produced the SPM.5 20th century
hindcast, then, do not reveal anything at all about the true physical state of the 20th century terrestrial
climate, within the resolution of 20th century forcing.
A point I've not seen mentioned anywhere yet is that if Anthony Watts» paper is accepted then it blows a massive hole in the regional
modelling of the US and hence the global
modelling of
climate, because the
models have to
hindcast as well as forcast.
We use this CTL run as a surrogate «real» world and then evaluate the predictability by
hindcasting this
model simulated
climate variability.
The potential to make skillful forecasts on these timescales, and the ability to do so, is investigated by means of predictability studies and retrospective forecasts (termed
hindcasts) using
climate models and statistical approaches.
So, inputting actual values of the cooling effect (such as the determination by Penner et al.) would make every
climate model provide a mismatch of the global warming it
hindcasts and the observed global warming for the twentieth century.
Also, in preparation for our simulations, we made
model hindcasts for a range of
climate sensitivities and forced by the estimated total radiative forcing anomaly for the period AD 1765 — 2012 (Fig.
And they consider it an unresolved mystery that all
models hindcast the 20th century temperature reasonably well while
climate sensitivities vary over a wide range.
If the
climate models use
hindcasting to Hadley or Giss pre-1979 temperature series as any sort of calibration, they are calibrating to a CREATED TREND, created using cooling adjustments to pre-1979 data.
The 20th century is very successfully
hindcasted by all the major
climate models.
For a group that trumpets the high - tech
climate modeling effort used to guide energy policy —
models which have failed to forecast (or even
hindcast!)