I guess this initial condition is rather remote from the final state; what does a change in column weight between these states then mean, since in the beginning, there was
far more water vapor present than would be realistic?
Not exact matches
It also would be
far easier to get a
water sample from Enceladus, which has plumes of
water vapor, ice and particles shooting
more than 300 miles off its surface, than from other moons, such as Jupiter's Europa, where a massive ocean is believed to be buried beneath a thick icy crust.
Another process knows as a «runaway greenhouse» occurs due to the increased greenhouse effect of
water vapor in the lower atmosphere, which
further drives evaporation and
more warming.
Further,
more fires would mean fewer trees and that could mean that less
water vapor transpired into the air, resulting in drier conditions.
That would suggest CO2 is
far from «weak», however, I would suggest that it is no
more important than
water vapor in the role it plays in past ice cycles (look at the numbers!).
More water vapor from rising temperatures will
further increase the temperature rise.
--- ignorance about atmospheric chemistry really shows here...... snip --- «Moreover, the CO2 that is supposedly causing «catastrophic» warming represents only 0.00035 of all the gases in the atmosphere (1.25 inches out of a 100 - yard football field), and proposals to control this vital plant nutrient ignore a
far more critical greenhouse gas:
water vapor.»
Re 9 wili — I know of a paper suggesting, as I recall, that enhanced «backradiation» (downward radiation reaching the surface emitted by the air / clouds) contributed
more to Arctic amplification specifically in the cold part of the year (just to be clear, backradiation should generally increase with any warming (aside from greenhouse feedbacks) and
more so with a warming due to an increase in the greenhouse effect (including feedbacks like
water vapor and, if positive, clouds, though regional changes in
water vapor and clouds can go against the global trend); otherwise it was always my understanding that the albedo feedback was key (while sea ice decreases so
far have been
more a summer phenomenon (when it would be warmer to begin with), the heat capacity of the sea prevents much temperature response, but there is a greater build up of heat from the albedo feedback, and this is released in the cold part of the year when ice forms later or would have formed or would have been thicker; the seasonal effect of reduced winter snow cover decreasing at those latitudes which still recieve sunlight in the winter would not be so delayed).
•
Water vapor in the troposphere increases with warming and in turn «absorbs
more heat and
further raises the Earth's temperature,» McPherson reports.
That 1 C in ocean temperature gives the atmosphere 7 %
more water vapor, which increases the GHG effect to about 1.7 C which gives
more water vapor increasing it
further in a series that converges to near 3 C.
I can certainly see that SOME CO2 level would do that, but everything I have read so
far about Antarctic says that in a somewhat warmer climate, which we will have in Antarctica soon, Antarctic as a whole will get
more snowfall, hence
more retention of ice, because warmer air holds
more water vapor, even if the increase in warmth is merely from minus 40 C to minus 35 C.
We have
far more data about increasing CO2 than increasing
water vapor, hence if we want to test this hypothesis by looking for a correlation between global warming and the combined effect of CO2 and H2O, a correlation with CO2 alone is
more feasible than one involving
water vapour.
By comparison,
water vapor, a
far more potent greenhouse gas, on average would occupy on average one floor and at times, especially in the tropics, up to four floors.»
They do so because within these models the
far more important radiative substances,
water vapor and clouds, act to greatly amplify whatever an increase in carbon dioxide might do.
radiation and
water vapor — but climate science is about
far more than this.
The overlap with the pure - rotational band of
water vapor eliminates most of the response from the lower band edge, and IR from clouds
further reduces the response to
more CO2.
Climatologists have been spending
far too much of their grant moneys toying around with models that include fudge factors for
water vapor and clouds that are little
more than guesses, making the models almost cartoons, instead of tackling the «toughest part» of the project.
We know
further, from laboratory work, that CO2, and
more importantly
water vapor, in the atmosphere serves to keep the Earth warmer than it would be in their absence.
Tropical
Water Vapor and Cloud Feedbacks in Climate Models: A
Further Assessment Using Coupled Simulations, Sun et al, 03/2009; read
more here.
And in the midst of this, the whole process is controlled by a complex
vapor -
water - cycle that is
far more powerful than the contribution CO2 makes.
As this process accelerates, the ice caps melt, releasing
more water vapor into the atmosphere via evaporation,
further compounding the effect caused by unregulated carbon dioxide emissions.
Why didn't the
water vapor feedback escalate
far more?
Still
more persuasive to scientists of the day was the fact that
water vapor, which is
far more abundant in the air than carbon dioxide, also intercepts infrared radiation.
(And I still can't see how a newly open and increasingly warm summer Arctic Ocean won't produce
more water vapor,
vapor whose GHG properties will
further accelerate Arctic warming — or is that completely offset by increased cloud formation??)
Water vapor is
FAR more efficient at absorbing long wave radiation than CO2.
Although less common than carbon dioxide and
water vapor, each molecule is
far more powerful and potentially as significant for global warming.
Also the reason
water vapor is ignored in the attacks on GHG is the fact that H2O is naturally
far more common in the atmosphere than CO2.....
Water vapor is a
far more powerful greenhouse gas than CO2, so its potential strength as a feedback mechanism is high.