However, Laden noted the study doesn't actually «say that one or another scenario is likely or less likely» and «says nothing about
the validity of climate models.»
I try to explain to all Global Warming detractors of your ilk... that it's fine to argue over scientific points and ask questions about
the validity of Climate Models...... But the second you start chucking out comments like yours....»
In addition, more extensive and more accurate scientific measurements are needed to test
the validity of climate models to increase confidence in their projections.
This discrepancy had previously been used to challenge
the validity of climate models used to detect and attribute the causes of observed climate change.
They do, however, raise serious questions about
the validity of climate models (which are, of course, used to predict future warming and are used to set public policy and sway public opinion) and how much we are actually warming.
This brings the second issue: how do you check
the validity of a climate model?
Not exact matches
As far as i was aware the
climate sensitivity issue still remains, as too do the questions over the
validity of the temperature records (raising the distinct possibility that the change you are trying to detect is smaller than the error limits themselves) and the
modelling parameters.
As I said in my reply to Wegman, ordinarily I would agree with him that science shouldn't be conducted through blogs, but in the case
of climate science an opinion about global warming in general, or the
validity of multiproxy reconstructions or
climate models in particular seems to constitute for some a political viewpoint that must be either trumpeted from the rooftops or suppressed by any means possible regardless
of its scientific merit.
Those numbers were based on crude
climate models whose
validity had never been tested by observations — and even today, there remains no validation for the
climate models that are at the heart
of most claims
of climate catastrophe.
In a
climate case, more so than any other policy - related case, courts need to inform themselves
of the range
of scientific opinions, the specific points
of agreement and disagreements, the assumptions made by scientists, their theories and reasoning, the
validity and accuracy
of the
models used, the unknowns, uncertainties, and gradations, etc..
All
of this confirms the
validity of Dr Gray's comments that validation is mandatory for a
climate model and that,
However, its long been apperent that while
climate models and econ
models have similar levels
of scientific
validity, economists are far more willing to talk about assumptions their
models make, when and why those assumptions might or might not hold, etc., than
climate scientists.
For a useful critique
of model - starting - points which bear no relation to the real - world, see: D. Koutsoyiannis et al (2008) «On the credibility
of climate predictions» in Hydrological Sciences 53 (4) August 2008 671-684, who conclude that the GCM
models defy normal assessments
of validity and should not be relied upon to predict future
climate change.
Therefore Bad Andrew, your commendable quest for verified
validity (V&V) in our understanding
of climate - change should focus upon the literature that validates and verifies
climate - change
models by comparison to multiple, independent, redundant channels, that cover all
of the earth's energy - entropy reservoirs.
In the
climate change field, it may be that the modellers, who in some cases appear to try to drive policy, need someone in my kind
of role, with enough comprehension to assess the
validity of the
models but with a better understanding
of, and ability to communicate, the policy relevance
of the material.
The answer will tell us a lot about the
validity of the
model - based estimate for
climate sensitivity used by IPCC (based on an «argument from ignorance», as has been pointed out)..
But running point scale intercomparisons
of the sort Koutsoyiannis did tells you little about the
validity of the
model with respect to the purpose for which it is designed; but does underline the limits
of global
models for regional
climate work.
... Abraham et al. take great pains to fault the
validity of a simple 1D
climate model to examine
climate sensitivity.
the computer
climate modelers require that the «Science is Settled» assumption to support the
validity of their approach and
models.
Climate models are not generally subjected to as stringent criteria
of validity as weather
models.
Because our
models should embody all physical knowledge
of climate, its status including
validity requires this step.
This unfortunately confirms the
validity of the Global
Climate Models which means we are warming and it is human caused.
Essex, McKitrick and Andresen (2007) have questioned the
validity of the global temperature anomaly as an indicator
of climate, but since the IPCC continues to compare it with
climate models, we should expect agreement.
When a continuing series
of peak hottest years occurs every four or five years, each peak a little hotter than the last, then there is an obvious temptation to view that particular metric as being a more useful indicator
of the
validity of the AR5
climate models than would be the central trend
of the observations.
page 6, on the «Exxon Knew» insinuation: No mention is made
of Exxon's forceful statement about the Inside
Climate News organization selectively choosing information, and careful reading of actual Exxon documents (e.g. this one) shows Exxon people questioning the validity of models predicting future climate cond
Climate News organization selectively choosing information, and careful reading
of actual Exxon documents (e.g. this one) shows Exxon people questioning the
validity of models predicting future
climate cond
climate conditions.
Even if
climate models were perfect — and we know they are not, which is why they are called «
models» — one would have to question the
validity of any such exercise.
I suspect these are the questions that would be at the root
of any doubts about the
validity climate models.
On the issue
of to what extent attribution «evidence» derived from GCMs / AOGCMs (the
validity of which is dependent on their
climate sensitivities being realistic) can be relied on, three academics who have published extensively on climate sensitivity, Chris Forest, Peter Stone and Andrei Sokolov, wrote about GCMs in «Constraining Climate Model Parameters from Observed 20th century Changes» (Tellus A, 2008) as f
climate sensitivities being realistic) can be relied on, three academics who have published extensively on
climate sensitivity, Chris Forest, Peter Stone and Andrei Sokolov, wrote about GCMs in «Constraining Climate Model Parameters from Observed 20th century Changes» (Tellus A, 2008) as f
climate sensitivity, Chris Forest, Peter Stone and Andrei Sokolov, wrote about GCMs in «Constraining
Climate Model Parameters from Observed 20th century Changes» (Tellus A, 2008) as f
Climate Model Parameters from Observed 20th century Changes» (Tellus A, 2008) as follows:
For a much more detailed discussion
of a sceptical scientist's view
of the
validity of using
model output as the basis for policing making in
climate science, take a look at Dr Roy Spencer's explanation
of how these
models work and why he thinks they are flawed:
«
Validity of models — there are many
climate models, not just one.
I've previously drawn attention to this need to ensure
validity of statistical inference as a reason why
climate modelling is not immune from these findings, but some here continue to seek refuge in the first point above i.e. this can't be right because it is inconsistent with the science.